Hourly pay will not fix the Auto Repair Industry
Hourly pay will not fix the Auto Repair Industry
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The diag is the most important part.
Unfortunately it pays to be stupid anymore.
I think shop owners have to realize yo umust chase the work. You cant run a dealership service dept without accounts. Door trafiic is not enough and the warranty times dont pay enough, newer high end cars arent kept long enough.
The door rate will go up but the techs rate will stay the same majority of the time. Greedy management will cause that. Flat rate guys who work fast will many times be exploited by manipulative management. Staying 11 hours to make 8 is slavery. 5 o’clock I’m gone, I have a life I don’t live to fix cars only. Perhaps flat rate plus a guarantee is best for both. Straight flat rate must go, door rates and technician pay must rise.
From ( Magic Hands) changed my name Mr. Clean shirt.
I bill right now 54 hours a week. But I only make 20hr. I’m a B tech but still. Not enough))$
Hi flat rate master. I work at Hyndai/ Kia dealership and we get a lot of warranty work 90% or more. 10 years 100k miles , so we have no control over diag fee, I think the hybrid method is the best. What do you think? Thanks
Flat rate works when techs make at least 60% of the door rate case closed
Your wrong
I work in the rust belt, flat rate small independent shop. Alot of the work coming in is older vehicles. Flat rates based of repair times of a new vehicle…. flat rate does not account for rust. I know it’s not every job but its sure hard to even match flate rate time when you have to heat every bolt,
If I wanted to work on flat rate I would become a one man shop. Why should I be risking anything when I am not getting the shop rate less all the overhead? Isn’t working a job all about shielding yourself from risk? Risk and reward go hand in hand. I get to choose what jobs I want to take on, where to spend the shop tool dollars, how much I can potentially make, and set all the shop rules…etc
Totally agree man!! Most of our tech make $25 and under. The dealer is charging $140 per hour labor rates. $95 for diagnostics. It’s insane how little our efforts get rewarded. Then they ask us to start early, short to no lunch and stay late!!
I don’t think hourly is the fix, but I think allot of shops should change the way they treat extended warranties which are very popular. Taking 60-70% of the customer pay amount because a third party warranty says you have to equals less money on everybody’s pocket.
Something that downright drives me nuts (and I’m saying this as both an automotive technician and on my spare time, a part time employee at an auto parts store) is parts stores offering free check engine light scans. It is INCREDIBLY misleading especially when well over 50% of the customers coming in treat it as a free "diagnostic
.." those codes aren’t gospel for crying out loud. They’re CLUES, and sometimes not even clues, but merely fault codes caused by something that went wrong within the system. Depending on exactly what when wrong and what code popped up, there could be NUMEROUS things that could’ve caused that code to pop up. Way too many people treat those "free code scans" as an excuse to shotgun parts and waste money on their cars when really they should take it to a shop and actually get it DIAGNOSED.
The only way to save flat rate
1. Mandate warranty rates and hours must equal customer rate
2. Minimize the administrative staff-Automated drop off kiosks-Automated workflow and job management. too many hands in the pot, advisors making more than techs (this is unacceptable)
3. Separate fixed ops from Dealer Sales (Sales will sell a car without wheels if they could get away with it.)
4. Shorter warranties
5. Mandate all advisors must have technical background
6. Eliminate commissioned parts and service upselling (So much unnecessary maintenance, snake oil additives and services piss informed customers off)
7. Automated parts system (We were getting to this in the Army) You have a reciever and a couple guys running the sales desk. Retrieval of parts and ordering done via computer and pickup trays.
To pay the technicians for what they worth, the median income in USA needs to be at 100,000 USD.
Yes, raise rates. People dont grasp inflation. They are fine asking for a raise from their boss, but when it comes to pay for a service theyll quote a price from 5 years prior.
I just saw your video is from 2019 before money printer went brrrrrr and government paid people to stay home.
Yeah, its weird. Im gearing up to go back to work (long injury), and going to work for …the master of recalls, FCA lol. Honestly I want the cars at tissue price. That will make up for lower pay.
lol, some people are better flat rate workers and some better hourly. People by nature wil lusually do the minimum whiuch is why people stay on the current upgraded unemployment benefits on 2021. Any tradesman is going t opretty much be able to always find a nother job. There is a shortage on skilled blue collar jobs because generations have been duped into thinking geting dirty is low end work socially.
Heavy duty shops are hourly. Why? Because they want everything done right and safely and not just rush through the work. When you flat rate and on a team with other techs. If the writer has favorites your screwed. Slow season, your screwed. Piss of your writer? Guess what your screwed. Asked for help on any little thing from another tech? They’ll want to flag time on your ro and boom. You lost your profit.
The real problem is shop labor rates keep going up but techs make the same, then to top that off the service writers want to haggle labor hours with the technicians to try and get there customers a cheaper price hey its not my fault the trans takes 13 hours and you have a whole rusted out undercarriage why should I lose my ass cause it’s all rusty!!! The writers need to know that labor guides are just guides and not set in stone I’m gonna charge extra for bolt extractions and having to cut off old rusted crap!! I’m about ready to start telling customers strait time for rusted cars !!
So a 2016 Chevrolet/GMC 2500/3500 6.6 Duramax headgasket job paying 17hrs warranty flat rate is gonna feed my family when customer pay on the same truck pays 42hrs? Answer how that is a good system when its 100% impossible to do that job in 17hrs without physical and mental injury. Its a bullshit system
Flat rate is go big or go home especially at the dealership
I’m a shop owner my guys are all hourly $27 +hr plus incentives and quarterly bonuses!!all 6 of my guys have been
with me for 5 years and all are making $75,000 a year I owe my success to them👌
As a flat rate technician I have turned 75 hrs in a 49hr week and saw my mentor turn 97 hrs in 49 hr on clock. But on average I was 80%. Brake jobs most alternators and starters are easy to beat time but brakes are usually something techs do the fastest. The average tech can do 14 brake jobs in a 8hr day
How do you expect to project professionalism when the majority of auto guys are illiterate, have no tools, all kinds of vices, only show up when they are out of money and drive bicycles??? The auto repair business has a bad reputation and most folks consider them thieves and scoundrels even if it isn’t true because one shop charges two bucks and the other two thousand, they just cannot get together and all make more money instead of working just to keep from getting bored..
When I started as a helper I would make 12/hr. Making around 950 every 1 and 15th. When I got moved up to flagging hours. I got bumped to 15/hr. But that didn’t mean shit. Because theh only kept throwing me warranty jobs. And oil change here , a tire change there. While other would get full services , customer pay jobs. So I would end up making 60 hours. Making around the same if not less! Than when I was a helper. So yeah i say fuck the flat rage system. Especially if the service advisor / dispatchers play favorites
The answer is don’t get into the auto industry. It sucks
Stop the flat rate system!
You know labor time is screwed up, it’s all based on some stupid engineers/tech working on brand new car with no rusted/seized parts and the labor time gets shorter and shorter!
Start paying hourly (plus commission based system as efficiency gets better). Sick and tired of not making dimes during slow season when you stay shop over hours with no cars coming in. It’s really hard when you are the bread earner of family. Pay the workers stable income.
Pay at least the same (not if higher) as other skilled trades like electrician or plumbers. Why is it that mechanics have to update their knowledge with every new model but no increase in wage. In fact our wage compares to electricians or plumbers is joke.
Shop should supply the tools. We can not keep spending $3,000 to 5,000 on tools every year because cars get more advanced while we make less than other trades with flat rates. I have not heard other trades spend this much money on tools(their company provides them!). The compamy should supply the tools. Or they should cover half the cost.
You all knew these days would come. But profit driven motives made all you higher ups short sighted. We technicians are the ones who physically work on cars and bring you the profits.
Millennials know the best when they smell BS. This trade is BS and the already know it. That’s why the younger generations are not getting into this trade.
You want workers? Then treat them right!
Why would anyone spend 50 to 100,000 on education to make 45-60 thousand a year if you do well. If you are going to spend that much on education most people not going to want to get dirty or do physical labor.
Thank you I couldn’t agree more, it’s sad that service industry is not valued
I refer to the middle guys / gals as "parts changers." They know more than a lube tech but can’t diagnose … so not a technician.
I work for a trucking company, where the shop is hourly, and they suck.
They are always " too busy" to get a simple job done fast.
Usually a 2 day "waiting" list
The mechanic usually ask for a week worth of pay for common Americans, assuming the median income at 60,000 USD. The mechanics are asking for too much money and drives most consumers away from their businesses.
As a reasonably competent shade tree guy (injectors on a CA LB7 Duramax, for one job) I do nearly all of my own routine work but also know my limitations.
That being said, I appreciate the incredible complexity of current auto technology (notice I didn’t say I understand it 😄) and feel folks working in repair shops, whether independent or dealership, are not being paid what they are worth, not only to their employer, but society as a whole.
Our society has become so dependent on private transportation that a safe, reliable vehicle is almost indispensable for anyone who needs to get to work and subsequently, experienced, knowledgeable AUTOMOTIVE TECHNICIANS play a vital role in keeping our economy going and deserve compensation of at least $60,000. If it means the public needs to pay more, or shops need a lower profit margin, well…so be it.
Stressed out techs, trying to beat the clock are a bad situation all the way around, and as someone noted in another comment here, I believe an appropriate, guaranteed income, based on experience, performance and management oversight is where the industry should be going.
Devil is in the details of course, but reading here indicates some shops have made it work!
Thanks for all you professionals do for us 👍👍👍.
Switching to hourly I feel like a lot of the things you said that need to happen would follow. Because shops would need to charge the customer more for diag and they’d actually see it is their time that’s being used when a technician is diagnosing a car.(At the point you’re hourly the shop can no longer use you as a scape goat and will have to find other avenues to save money and profit.)
Flat rate perpetuates greed and encourages technicians to do sloppy work to beat book time.
The way auto makers screw with labor times, flat rate just isn’t worth it.
Shops, especially dealers need to start sueing manufacturers for cooking the labor books and defrauding techs and shops. 24 States require OEMS to reimburse dealers at the same total work order as a customer repair job. Yet dealers still use the manufacturer times…a six hour customer job on Land Rover turbo pays 2.4 under warranty. The oems are not doing time studies they are just making crap up. The Ford repair time on the exact same engine in the exact same chassis….4.0 hours. I am fixing to file an FTC complaint against these manufacturers and get them forced to adopt industry standard hours. They are extending warranties on the backs of techs. Essentially we are fixing their screwups for less.
Diag pay would be a good start, and requesting more diag time without the bullshit most techs have to go through to get it. So imagine fighting an intermittent wiring concern and running out of your 1 hour diag time. Having to fight with the service advisor and service manager. Waiting on them to make that call to get an answer but they’ve been putting it off because they’re dreading getting the customer angry. While your lift has been down for 5 hours so you can make another hour of diag.
The problem with shops is usually only the techs are 100% commission. I think lotty dotty everybody should be 100% commission. Advisors need to be jumping to the phones, parts guys should be fighting for who’s counter I go to. Instead as a tech, its hard to get the other postions to simply do their jobs.
Meh, I was getting screwed over at a Honda dealer doing major warranty work like replacing transmissions for five hours labor and only getting paid $16.50 an hour I left and went to a major GM dealership and get paid a very fair salary now to inspect and repair high mileage used cars. Many of them need lots of repairs and I often end up doing more than 40 hours of flat rate work. Hell this week I dropped two drivetrains for engine out repairs and would’ve probably totaled close to 70 hours. But I’m very happy with the salary and don’t stress over anything.
The industry is dead to me I’m done.
I’m going to a different career path. Glad I learned though cause I can work on my own cars.
Our shop is hourly with the flat rate time on our time card we get, it may say .3 for a oil sample, there’s some times 6-10 samples to pull, we have sample ports on the machines 😃, sometimes I wish we were flat rate, even with the hourly with flat rate time on it, were graded on production, they came up with the times instead of going by the book, but it’s in your favour. Not bragging but I stay at a 100+ at my age 😃..most techs milk the cow here, to me that’s a long day..this is another great video, been watching all yours trying to catch up lol, looking forward to see more
you are way off about charging more more for diagnostics and for car repair you’ve already priced yourselves out of many many peoples budgets why do you think there are so many do-it-yourselfers
Hourly WILL fix the problems. When your shop has a reputation for paying technicians well then you don’t have to tolerate lazy unproductive technicians. You can show them the door and put someone in their place.
Until techs walk out the door for good, nothing changes!
You’re right about what matters is the end pay and not how you get it. Until your end pay is shit because you keep getting warranty bullshit. .2 here .3 there seriously ? It does matter when you got other techs making 100 plus hours from services and I’ll be lucky if I get an oil change with a couple other fluid services. I have made the same if not less than what I would make as a helper getting paid hourly
your absolutely right, I constantly under value my work
Unions are absolutely necessary for mechanics. We have unions for plumbers, electricians and even security guards. Why can’t we have unions for mechanics? Flat rate is a rip off and is a form of exploitation. For example, an oil change with tire rotation pays .4 hours. In some shops is less or a little more. Lets say half an hour. If the mechanic encounters rusted bolts, stripped oil plugs, or any other issue that makes its job harder and takes longer than the standard time of .4, then that mechanic should be paid more than the standard time for that oil change and tire rotation because now he has to deal how to fix that stripped oil plug or oil pan, or remove that severely corroded bolt, which takes extra time of his physical strength, time and energy. Therefore, it is not only fair, but also it is an incentive for that mechanic to work more efficient knowing that he will be paid for that extra work. That is why, some mechanics take sure cuts when doing a repair because of this system of flat rate. They are trying to beat the clock in order to get the next car in their bay. This constant pressure on mechanics causes them to make more mistakes and their quality of work goes down as a result. The perfect formula should be: the more time it takes for a specific job, the more it should pay. This does not mean in any way to promote laziness because I am talking about "socially necessary labor time" invested in production. This is simple economics or marxist economics. Economists or mainstream Harvard, Yale and bourgeois economists failed to understand this economic reality, which Marx himself discovered.
Great content some areas where i have lived don’t have the amount of business to go flat rate for a desent pay. The amount of equipment over the years makes your post 👍
The first 4 or so years were hard. Just about all my pay checks went to tools, boots, school and books. After work I had about 50 hours worth of online training for honda due at the end of the month th that you don’t get payed to do. Infact managers get bonuses for how many online modules you complete online but as the person doing the training gets $0
I get mixed pay. But they expect me to be at 120% an clean an fix other techs messes an stock sn clean. They keep bringing up min wage an not middle of the hill people putting them on the bottom